Hi Patrick! It's great that you're here and that we can talk. First of all, congratulations, you have completed your second state law examination as third best in the whole of Lower Saxony. How do you feel?
Patrick: Thank you. It's been a few months now. The initial euphoria has disappeared. After almost ten years of training, however, it was very easier to have completed everything. Starting your career now feels like a fresh start. There is still so much to learn!
Have you worked specifically towards your result? Or were you also a bit surprised by the good result?
Patrick: I've already worked specifically for a good result, but the result was still surprising. It takes a lot of work and you have to work through regular exams. But of course, a little luck also plays a role, and you can't fully plan such an outcome.
How ambitious are you?
Patrick: I describe myself as sectorally ambitious! My ambition varies from area to area. At school and at university, I was very ambitious and was also very annoyed by defeats. In other areas, such as tennis, I used to be more ambitious but now more relaxed. I'm not going to win Wimbledon anymore. I've set priorities and put sport on the back burner for my career — especially when it became clear that I wasn't going to earn any money from it. At least not more than a minimum wage.
How did you start your career at activelaw? What did you learn in the first few months?
Patrick: I've definitely learned a lot! Especially when it comes to practical work and time management. Deadlines generally play a major role, and it's important to keep track of them. Above all, I've learned to organize myself better. Then many cases are not about “law on high altitude”, but above all about practical relevance. After all, you have to be able to prove everything you claim in court. Convincing execution and presentation are extremely important.
What do you think of working with experienced colleagues at activelaw?
Patrick: The collaboration is very pleasant. The young career starter often asks himself what he should actually do now. I get this question answered regularly, along with one: “You can do it! “It's really very nice, especially in our team. Our responsible partner Dr. Alexander Nefzger has remarkable expertise and provides support wherever possible.
Topic of work culture: How do you experience the generational differences in the law industry? The cliché would be that you work 60 hours as a lawyer and have no regular working hours. In turn, the younger generation is said to no longer want to do that at all. How do you experience that?
Patrick: The 60-hour week is more for large law firms. I worked in a large law firm in Frankfurt, so the 60 hours were definitely not a cliché. As a lawyer, you certainly work more than average, but I think that applies to all academic professions. But it's within the frame. But I've never worked 60 hours here before, and I've always been able to do my normal sport in the evening. I find the differences between generations to be less significant than is often described. Rather, I think it is an individual decision. It is being exploited more in the media than it actually is, think of the many early retirees, for example. In my circle of acquaintances, for example, no one works 20 hours a week, everyone more.
At the beginning of the year, there were many demonstrations against right-wing extremism, and you wrote an interesting post privately under the hashtag #niewiederist. What responsibility do you see as a lawyer in society?
Patrick: As a lawyer, you are a service provider. At the same time, you are an independent body of the administration of justice, at least as stated in the Federal Lawyers' Ordinance. I have the responsibility to defend the liberal democratic basic order. You can't be clamped down for everything, especially if it contradicts the principles of the rule of law. However, my area, corporate law, is very apolitical, as the conflict usually does not arise.
Are you an idealistic person?
Patrick: Yes, I have ideals, but I also fail at them. I'm certainly not the first and the last to find out. However, many goals also change over the course of life. Overall, however, I find it super important to have ideals — even if you don't always achieve them!
So what are you doing today after work?
Patrick: I'm planning to go for a run. I have decided to run more regularly in order to prepare for the upcoming company run at B2Run. I don't want to be the last out of the law firm to finish and I don't want to collapse halfway through. So much about ambition...
I've set out to do that too, but I've failed to achieve this ideal so far.
Patrick: Things are also rather slow for me.
Do you have any last tips for young career starters or students?
Patrick: Indeed! The world won't end from a state examination in law. After my exams, I went to my polling station at the German embassy in Bangkok and left everything behind for now. And especially when you see and get to know a different culture, a different perspective was really good for me. It's easy to say in retrospect, of course, but people will be happy even without a state law exam. Especially with the second — you've already done the first and aren't left with nothing. You should of course take it seriously and prepare yourself well, but don't stress too much. The world continues to turn, no matter how the exam turns out.
A nice final word. Thank you very much for the interview!
